Signal

The 'Astra can read and write weights to improve Qwen' post is misleading

First reported by Honnibal.dev ·

The signal ●●○○ Compiled by AI from Honnibal.dev, Hacker News, The Register, Simon Willison's Weblog, anderegg.ca and 4 more
Why you might care

The ability to modify large language model weights directly using AI without extensive fine-tuning has not yet been demonstrated as claimed.

What happened

A recent post claimed that an AI model named Astra could improve the Qwen language model by "reading and writing weights" without external feedback. However, an analysis by Matthew Honnibal of honnibal.dev argues this claim is misleading. The original post presented multiple experiments, some that genuinely analyzed raw model weights, and others that involved writing Python code to interact with or modify those weights. Honnibal highlights that the most impressive results, particularly the improvement in Qwen's math performance, were achieved through Python scripting and running the model on practice problems, not solely by inspecting raw weights. The experiments that directly read raw weights were on smaller networks and did not involve modifying them or achieving significant performance gains on large language models.

What it means

The core of the misleading claim rests on conflating different AI capabilities. While some experiments showed models analyzing raw weights on smaller networks, the significant performance improvements on large models like Qwen were facilitated by Python code execution. This means Astra was not performing a novel weight analysis or editing feat directly on the raw weights for those tasks, but rather using programmatic tools to simulate such an improvement.

This distinction is critical for understanding the actual progress in AI model manipulation. The original post's abstract implies a direct, self-contained method for AI to understand and fix complex model issues from weights alone. The reality, as detailed by Honnibal, is that Astra's success in improving Qwen was dependent on its ability to write and execute code, a capability that is powerful but fundamentally different from directly "reading and writing weights" in the sense implied.

AI-written summary. May contain errors.

Astra